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hi where are the male dancers of KC, or surrounding. I have a male student that wants to know the good stuff.
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Kansas City
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Re: Kansas City MO,KS guys
Fri, November 18, 2005 - 10:25 PMUntil someone chimes in who is local, may I take this opportunity to plug my upcoming workshop in Sedalia, MO in March?
March 4/5, 2006.
Judy Cunningham is hosting me.
Workshops & Shows.
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Re: Kansas City MO,KS guys
Sat, November 19, 2005 - 7:26 PMHello, Etoile!
I'm Hassan Ali, and I live in Lawrence. Since you are in KC, I would suggest looking up Siham Ali. She taught my instructor Jemira Ali, and seems to think I'm doing alright.... It'd be a good place to start.
With whom have you taken lessons from yourself? For how long, and where?
I'll be going to Jim's workshop as well!
Nice to see you here,
Hassan -
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Re: Kansas City MO,KS guys
Sun, November 20, 2005 - 11:53 PMhello hello
the workshop sounds great
I am with Maya Zahira and I have danced for 2 years. thanks so much for replying back. it is good to know that Jemira knows the men's style.
I think there is a specific "men's style" right? or do you just take basic bellydance moves and make them manly?
please don't take offence. I really need to know. -
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Re: Kansas City MO,KS guys
Mon, November 21, 2005 - 4:18 AMHaving been a Martial Artist for some time, I have come to realize that there are just so many ways a human body can move. With that in mind, and a good understanding of basic bodily stucture; male versus female, it is only natual to see that even though I might be copying a movement from a woman it will be done in a "manly" fashion.
That is to say, unless it is your goal to LOOK like a woman dancing, it will be difficult to do it accidentaly. I do struggle to achieve the fluidity of motion that comes so easily to you, however, with my muscle mass it will not have that decidedly feminine flaire.
In answer to your question, no, I don't really belive there is a "mens" specific style. There may be a few movements that are inherently masculine/feminine, but not an entire style per se.
What do you think, Jim?
Hassan
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Re: Kansas City MO,KS guys
Mon, November 21, 2005 - 9:29 AMYou got it the same way I teach it, Hassan.
The way I help women, especially teachers, to visualize this:
Women come in many shapes, sizes, dimensions and abilities. usually, as they're learning the dance, they find there are movements that look better on them...or depending on how the teacher teaches it, they need to adjust it to look good on their bodies.
Same thing for guys.
We just have to keep working the movements to get them to look 'right'.
A decade ago we had very few examples of men dancing outside of the folkloric realms. Luckily, we have quite a few examples, with more and more becoming available on video/DVD and performance. It's easier with examples in both performance and instruction these days. THANKS to those who went before us!
There ARE men's dances. But when it comes to Raks Sharki, there is little precedent in the performance styles.
Hassan: muscle mass should not preclude fluidity. ;)
I'm 6'2"/230# and although I'm WAY below my previous dimensions when I was dancing, I still have quite a bit of muscle mass. Remember: stretch stretch stretch. Course, I've had guys in my classes who do martial arts and they could do some incredible splits, kicks, and more...things I would never even imagine being able to do. -
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Re: Kansas City MO,KS guys
Mon, November 21, 2005 - 12:20 PMthanks so much for the input -
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Re: Kansas City MO,KS guys
Mon, November 21, 2005 - 4:10 PMThere's a great webpage I found called "Masculine Belly Dance By Stefan" which has some great tips "For concerned teachers & self-starter students who aren't "trying to get in touch with their feminine side." Check it out...
www.bdancer.com/Masculine.html
In the meantime, here is my interpretation on the subject inspired by Hassan... thanks for getting me thinking! (love your pics btw!!!!)
I think it IS possible for a male bellydancer to appear feminine in motion accidentally or at least inadvertently lol. For example, when I dance, my biggest goal is for it to be beautiful... my #1 goal is not for it to appear hot, sexy, seductive, technically correct, masculine, feminine or anything else. However, I was raised to believe that "beautiful" is a feminine word in itself. Go figure, lmao. So although I am not trying to be feminine, Maharasha's dance can only look one way: feminine.
Also, when I speak of my experience while in the heat of bellydance, I usually liken it to having the "holy ghost" as can be seen in many African-American churches. Supposedly it's a state where one is filled with the Spirit of Christ and all actions from that point on for a period of time are not there own. They begin dancing wildly across the church, screaming and crying uncontrollably and speaking in "tongues". That's what my bellydance experience is like, but when I am filled with the "holy ghost" it is the essence of the Goddess. A lot of people, like myself, are shocked when they see me dance because they, #1, can't believe I'm a guy and, #2, don't believe a guy could move so gracefully.
But the truth is, when I dance, it is not me. A lot of times, I feel like I'm sitting in the crowd with the rest of the audience watching a beautiful portrait being painted or an eloquent story being told... much like an out-of-body experience. Why? Because at the very moment when I feel the music the most, when intuition and musical interpretation collide, when all inhibitions are burned away and the body moves of its own volition, my audience is experiencing the power and beauty of the Goddess, not Maharasha.
So again, if that is the case which for me I know it is then my movements, my painting, my story can't help but appear feminine. But the most awesome part of it all is, I don't care. Those who appreciate beauty and passion and heartfelt giving of self don't linger on the superficial notions of what is male and female, they just enjoy the moment. Wow! I did my first real rant! That was fun, lol
~Maharasha the Male Bellydancer: Las Vegas, NV
spaces.msn.com/members/maharasha -
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Stefan, femininity, Duende and the Holy Ghost
Mon, November 21, 2005 - 10:39 PMDamien, before you get too caught up in Stefan's writings, be aware that it has not been updated in a VERY long time, and some of his advice is downright dangerous to you as a dancer. Be wary of things that have no bibliography or references.
I do agree with some of his ideas about masculinity in dance, and I also acknowledge that sometimes no matter how masculine we are, we show a feminine side when we dance.
Not sure I agree that beautiful can only mean feminine, but that is a discussion for another time and another place. (Preferably with an icy Gin martini in my hand and a comfortable chaise longue under my posterior! ;-))))
You mention being filled with the spirit of the Holy Ghost.
In Flamenco dance, they call this feeling Duende. It is that moment when you are one with the music and the dance that comes forth is purely from the soul. You are filled with a spirit, some say it is a friendly demon of dance.
In the Jamaican culture, this uncontrollable dancing is called Pocomania. It is sometimes comparable to what is being called "Ecstatic dancing" here in North America.
I haven't tried that yet, because I don't like opening my soul up like a Happy Meal at a daycare. To my mind, I am VERY vulnerable when I dance. -
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Re: Stefan, femininity, Duende and the Holy Ghost
Tue, December 20, 2005 - 3:44 PMduodenum?
What was that thing about the icy cold gin again?
Should I bring my shaker to Toronto in October or will you have an extra?
Do you need references for my bartending or do gin blossoms count? ;) -
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This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.
Re: Stefan, femininity, Duende and the Holy Ghost
Tue, December 20, 2005 - 10:27 PMYeh... Duodenum... that inflamed part of your body (Not THERE cheekymonkey!) after four gin martinis and one dirty gin martini. <WEG>
Ahh, but these days they can cut that out and give you a nice decorative bag to carry around under your clothes. Wassail!
You have to remember though, Icy cold gin in Toronto in October simply means holding a bottle of Bombay Sapphire outside your window for 15 minutes. :)
I will have an extra shaker, just cuz I know you are coming, Mr. Jim. :)
Besides it really all depends on whether you prefer them shaken or stirred. If you prefer stirred then I'm gonna have to bring my big glass pitcher (though stirring bruises the gin, I'm told. Pfah!). If shaken, then I'll bring my antique Chrome shaker that pours for four in one fell swoop. :)
References? Not at all my good man, not at all. I'll ask Yasmina... ;-)
Rowf! -
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Re: Stefan, femininity, Duende and the Holy Ghost
Tue, December 20, 2005 - 10:33 PMMy martinis:
Gin...always gin. Vodka martinis are a sin against the laws of man and God. (It's tongue in cheek, gang...roll with it. ;)
Dry like the sahara...think of vermouth...then put it out of your mind.
Shaken...more like brutally beaten.
Up - one olive
Club soda back if necessary (helps with the hangover in the morning...trust me..I'm a trained professional and I DON'T go to meetings!)
It's cold in Toronto? Like...um...50 degrees? It's been cold here...almost 55 I think. I'm glad it's up to 80 during the day. brrrrr
and you said Bombay Sapphire.
Did I cue that? Or do we just have the same taste in gin?
Have you tried Tanqueray 10? -
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Re: Stefan, femininity, Duende and the Holy Ghost
Tue, December 20, 2005 - 10:37 PMI must add: I'm a 'cocktail of the season' guy. Right now it's tangerine margaratinis since Odwalla tangerine juice is really good and in season.
1 part Jose Cuervo Gold (don't go cheaper, but could go better...I'm not a tequila connoisseur, so your judgement might be better than mine)
1/2 part triple sec
1 part lime margarita mix (hey, it's a quickie)
1 part tangerine juice
shake in a shaker over ice and strain into a martini glass (with salt if desired)
I need a better holiday drink. I'm still searching. I'm thinking this year something bubbly and gingery, so I might do another champagne type of cocktail. My summer one was a hit.
So...who knows what I'll be drinking in October, eh? -
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Re: Ow! My Duodenum hurts & Djinngery Djrinks
Tue, December 20, 2005 - 10:58 PM!!!
Tangerine Margaratinis!?
OOoooo ahm Dyyyyin'!
I hope you don't mind if I try this recipe in January. I now have an excuse to go buy Tequila.
And if you are thinking bubbly and gingery, try using Jamaican Ginger Beer in your recipes. It is truly gingery and adds a throat zing to any drink.
Valizan
Drinker? Me? Never! -
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Re: Ow! My Duodenum hurts & Djinngery Djrinks
Tue, December 20, 2005 - 11:07 PMYou're up late.
hmm...Jamaican Ginger Beer.
Think I can I get that locally?
I have a host of recipes that I hope to release before the "Bad Girls of Belly Dance" party at Rakkasah West this year.
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Re: Ow! My Duodenum hurts & Djinngery Djrinks
Tue, December 20, 2005 - 11:12 PMI wonder if we could support a chat board..like real time chat.
hmmm
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Duende, duodenum's and Djinn... I mean gin.
Tue, December 20, 2005 - 10:54 PMIndeed, always Gin. I don't mind a Vodka martini, but Vodka ain't my thing unless I'm drinking with Russians or Ukrainians.
I actually like some vermouth in my martinis. Yes, dry is good, but what is the point of putting on a fine tuxedo, with cumberbund, patent shoes and bouttoniere if you're not going to wear the bow tie? The right vermouth makes up for a lot of sins.
Shaken... Yessssss... Chrome tower it is.
One olive? I like three. One to start. One for the middle, and a safety olive to either play with during conversation (tap olive gently against the glass... then drop it back into the drink. It makes the A-Types mental... and really they need to learn to loosen up.) or just to finish the drink. YMMV. I don't fuss on this detail.
I didn't know that about the club soda.
"Its cold in Toronto?" Did you give your head a Valley Girl toss when you said that? :)))) And no need to tease the Canadians (Especially an Aiwa Kanadi) about the fact you are basking in warm weather while we're dressed like alien extras from Star Trek. Besides... I'm off to Jamaica on Friday! ;-P
Hmmm, now what would be the Tribal cue for Bombay Sapphire? :)))
No sir, you didn't cue that. Good taste is universal. :) And I have never heard of Tanqueray 10, but methinks a trip to the LCBO is in order. -
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Re: Duende, duodenum's and Djinn... I mean gin.
Tue, December 20, 2005 - 11:05 PMThe wonderful thing about martinis is that there is a different one for every martini drinker.
<happy sigh> It's a good thing. ;)
I don't even eat my olive. I just like the way it makes the last couple sips of the 'tini taste.
I started drinking gin because I'm a horrible introvert, and if I got to a bar before my friends I'd sit there and chug 5-7 Jack & Coke's in a dark corner and be toasted to quickly.
Ugh.
So I started with gin because I couldn't stand it.
Alas, I acquired the taste. heh heh
I don't mind harrassing the Canadians. We love hosting here in SD...and without the 'fair weather discount', we can't afford to bring in the 'names'. :)
Tribal cues: anything you want them to be, eh?
Okay, two Egyptian Basics, cue a 180 turn, then return with the shaker and serve.
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